Turning Ideas into Top Sellers with Robert Yusim with Robert Yusim
In this episode of Making It in The Toy Industry, we delve into the world of consumer product marketing and licensing with special guest Robert Yusim. We open with a captivating discussion on the value of ideas versus inventions and the crucial steps needed to turn an idea into a marketable product. Robert shares his journey into the toy industry and how he's helped launch numerous successful consumer products, including the iconic Thighmaster, Pixicade, and more.
Discover the magic behind making products licensable even when they're not patentable, and how adding value to your invention can significantly impact your licensing deals. Robert sheds light on the ever-evolving nature of the toy industry, where staying on trend and refreshing your products are essential for success.
Join us as we explore Robert's impressive career, from his early days working with Spin Master to his role in the rocket fishing rod's massive success. Whether you're an aspiring toy inventor or a product marketer, Robert's experiences and advice in this episode are invaluable.
Episode Cliff Notes
[00:00:00] Discover the essence of adding value to an idea beyond its conception.
[00:01:13] Meet Robert Yusim, an accomplished consumer products marketer.
[00:10:25] Learn about the significance of mentors, networking, and building valuable connections.
[00:12:00] Distinguish between an idea and an invention and why substance is crucial.
[00:14:00] What makes non-patentable inventions licensable? Discover the key factors.
[00:18:00] A compelling success story involving Pixicade and the strategies behind its growth.
[00:22:08] Valuable advice for aspiring entrepreneurs starting their own business ventures.
[00:22:51] Find out what toy blew Robert Yusim's mind as a kid.
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This episode is brought to you by www.thetoycoach.com
Robert routinely reviews inventions and/or sits on pitch panels at many of the largest trade shows including The Licensing Show, The Inspired Home (Housewares) Show, Toy Fair and more. Robert has also written many published articles and speaks at various conferences. You can reach Robert through his website ProductCounsel.com or email at RY@ProductCounsel.com.
Support the show when you purchase one of the products Rob helped bring to market via the links below.
Pixicade Pets VIP: Draw Your Own Pets & Bring Them to Life
Pixicade: Transform Creative Drawings to Animated Playable Kids Games On Your Mobile Device -
[00:00:00] Robert Yusim: ideas are a dime a dozen. So There is very little value in an idea unless you do added value to turn it into, you know, a prototype, a patent, you know, a provisional patent application a video to support the, your proof of concept.\
[00:00:17] You are listening to Making It in the Toy Industry, episode number 205. [00:01:00]
[00:01:13] Azhelle Wade: Hey there, toy people, Azhelle Wade here, and welcome back to another episode of the Toy Coach Podcast, making it in the toy industry. This is a weekly podcast brought to you by thetoycoach. com. My guest today is one that I know so many of you are going to be excited to meet because he works directly with Inventors and entrepreneurs like you.
[00:01:34] Robert Usim has a passion for helping inventors and companies launch their new consumer products. He has successfully launched hundreds of consumer products and brands, totaling in billions of dollars in sales across most consumer categories, including housewares, kitchen, health, beauty, fitness, hardware, automotive, and of course.
[00:01:52] Toys. Dating back to the 90s, Robert has been part of the success of many as seen on TV consumer brands, including the [00:02:00] Suzanne Somers Thighmaster, Sweeper Rubber Broom, Sofista Twist, and many more. More. But let's talk about the successes in the toy industry, Pixicate, Pop to Play, the Flare O Light Makeup Brush and Knuckles.
[00:02:13] So many great products. I'm thrilled to welcome Robert to the show today. Welcome, Robert.
[00:02:19] Thank you, Ajhelle
[00:02:20] I haven't had many people that specialize in licensing and representing inventors on the podcast and oftentimes the people that I have had have moved out of licensing since being on the podcast.
[00:02:31] So I actually get emails where people are saying, Hey, I reached out to that person. They don't do licensing anymore. So I'm really excited to have you on the show.
[00:02:38] first I'd love to know how you first got into the toy industry.
[00:02:44] Robert Yusim: So my, my mentors were the guys that started a very famous company, it was called KTEL.
[00:02:49] Basically I got a job with them coming out of college and one of our big toy products was something called grip ball, which was a paddle Velcro tennis [00:03:00] like ball.
[00:03:00] And it was this catch game and it was toy of the year. And my boss said to me, Rob, I'd like you to find more products to fill the pipeline. So, you know, no internet back then I was doing my research and I found all these kids playing with devil sticks, you know, two sticks juggling a third stick. And he said, so he said, go make a deal.
[00:03:21] So I walk into a warehouse in Toronto and I meet these three young guys fresh out of college. Their names are Anton, Ben and Renan, the founders of Spin Master way back in the early twenties. And actually I did their first international deal. I took a devil sticks to Australia. I hired Anton's brother, Lawrence, and we went down to Australia together, sold the product into all the retailers like Kohlmeyer, Target, Toys R Us, Woolworths.
[00:03:49] And we left Lawrence there to do the in store demos and the van tour. And it was a great success. And it was more importantly, the beginning of a friendship between myself and these three young guys from Spin Master. So that's [00:04:00] how I really got
[00:04:01] Azhelle Wade: in. What is the magic that you think you hold that makes you so good at deals?
[00:04:07] Robert Yusim: I think I have an eye for product, number one. But the other thing is I know how to market and I think that, you know, Being presented with an opportunity 10 years after that initial meeting from Spinmaster on a product called the rocket fishing rod, them wanting to get into the direct to consumer business and not knowing how to do it.
[00:04:25] And based on a friendship and a trust, they wanted me to help them out. So basically I created this whole campaign for the rocket fishing rod. I, I did a financial Maudeel built the offer developed all the initial creative as executive producer, then put up all the backend to be able to support the campaign, put it up on air.
[00:04:46] And it was a massive success right away. And within one year, it was actually the number one product in Walmart's outdoor department. So following that great success, like two weeks after the initial direct to consumer launch, I get a call from spin and they [00:05:00] say, Maybe we have a lightning in a bottle. Why don't you check out this other product and if you can do the same thing we're gonna go on a ride that you wouldn't believe.
[00:05:08] So basically they show me a pile of sand, molds together, never dries out, comes in a bunch of colors, moon sand, now it's called kinetic sand. So basically I launched that entire sand category and you know, we did 350 million dollars worth of sand over a five year period.
[00:05:26] Azhelle Wade: There are great products and there are many people who can identify great products, but I wonder if the magic that you have is being able to put yourself in the mindset of either a consumer or a retailer, because I think it must take that to be able to sell a good product and make other people see the value in it.
[00:05:44] Robert Yusim: Well, I think it's both. I think that you have to kind of see the paradigm all the way from idea generation all the way to the consumer. So the whole process is driven by everyone adopting it, loving it, wanting it, you know, all the way and making sure that it's priced right because [00:06:00] that's where the financial Maudeel comes in.
[00:06:02] Like you can have the best product in the world, but if it's not priced properly, it won't work. So there's so many great products that were overengineered and couldn't make it to the market because the, you know, the perceived value didn't make sense.
[00:06:14] Azhelle Wade: Working in the toy industry, you just get used to seeing a product and thinking the price that it should be. But I had recently did a presentation for a non toy product. And I didn't know what it should cost. And I had to start comparing competitor products to understand the value similar products in the market. And I think that's something that people tend to skip over. I'm so used to it in the toy industry, but as soon as I look at a new industry, I'm like, Oh, I don't know, I have to do research and figure this out. And that must be what some of your clients need help with.
[00:06:47] Robert Yusim: Yeah. And I think there's a rule of thumb. I think everything is really a function of cost of goods. So if you have the right cost of goods, it'll cascade all the way through to the right retail price.
[00:06:56] If you don't have the right price cost of goods. Then you end up with a [00:07:00] cost, you know, a price that is much higher than the perceived value. So the equation that I work with, like people, people often ask me, like, is there a threshold on price that actually works? And I say, really, my metric is, is perceived value greater or equal to the price of the product?
[00:07:15] Then you have a fighting chance.
[00:07:17] Azhelle Wade: How do you determine perceived value?
[00:07:19] Robert Yusim: That's, you know, the competitive marketplace and understanding, you know, where, you know, that widget would fit among many other widgets and, you know, and I think there's a feel to it. I think you have an eye for it and you get a feeling and I've been doing it for decades.
[00:07:32] Azhelle Wade: Do you find with new clients that, you'll tell them what the perceived value is and they'll say, no, no, no, but it has to cost more because my cost of goods and this is my, this is my price.
[00:07:43] And then you have to kind of train them. Like I understand, but the perceived value for this item is X and, and you have to either get them to come down or raise that value somehow.
[00:07:54] Robert Yusim: Well, I have a real life example that I'm working on right now. I'm working with a woman who has a [00:08:00] wonderful plush product.
[00:08:01] And her pricing was just too high. And I was able to actually get her the right manufacturer to reduce her cost of goods . With that version two, when she's coming out in the market with that, she'll be well priced and at perceived value with ample margin to be able to, you know, work in between and be successful.
[00:08:18] I look at it as like the financial component of a consumer product is 50 percent of the value of success. Obviously the product is going to be critically important, but beyond that, all the cost structures along the way, cost of goods, selling price, retail price, all have to work for everybody.
[00:08:35] Azhelle Wade: Now finish this sentence for me. The thing that surprised me most about the toy industry was?
[00:08:40] Robert Yusim: How fashion oriented it was, like how? Like when I first got in, like you know, I, I worked on the Thighmaster and it was the same product for basically three years that I worked on it. Yes, we had a version two later on, but what I found interesting and surprising for the toy industry is really every six months you have to have [00:09:00] an update.
[00:09:00] To be able to be fashion forward on trend, you know, building the brand, adding a license, creating and continuing the excitement for that product. So there's a lot of work that is just like continually ongoing from a fashion standpoint. to really ensure that that brand, you know remains, you know relevant.
[00:09:21] Azhelle Wade: That is such a good point. sometimes people come to me and they'll say, Oh, I want to release five SKUs. And actually, you might want to think about dripping those over years because the toy industry, we love new, right? Every show you go to, the buyer is going to say, what do you have new?
[00:09:35] And if you release them all the first year, even if you had little placement, the second year, they're still going to say what's new.
[00:09:41] Robert Yusim: And even in my early years, like that SophisticTwist product that you mentioned earlier, it was basically it was a hair design product.
[00:09:47] It was a piece of velvet and with a hole in the middle with wire around it. And you put your hair through and then you wind it up and you create these buns and twists and curls in your hair. And we sold millions of them. But we didn't change the [00:10:00] product. It was essentially, you know, maybe we added more colors and stuff like that, but for the most part it was the same product for two, three years.
[00:10:06] You get into the toy business and it's an entirely different animal because it's so fashion oriented and you have to be, you know, continually updating your product with refreshes and new features and licenses. So there's, you know, a lot to stay on top of.
[00:10:21] Azhelle Wade: Who helped you along your journey to become the man you are today in the toy industry?
[00:10:25] A
[00:10:25] Robert Yusim: lot of people. Even before the toy industry, like, you know, when I was in university, I owned a campus marketing business. I created these products that I distributed at various universities. In colleges. So I had campus calendars. I had student discount cards and I had coupon books and these were distributed and they were doing really well.
[00:10:44] And actually when I graduated, I thought maybe I'll scale this business even larger and, you know, turn it into a national enterprise. And I learned something pretty quickly when you're a student. And you're going to student unions all over the place to, you know, get their support for distribution or wanting to get involved.
[00:10:59] They [00:11:00] love you and they want to be involved. But the moment you graduate, you're not one of them anymore. And it made it much more difficult actually as a non student to be able to actually run that particular business. So I ended up selling that business. And my accountant said to me, what would you like to do?
[00:11:15] And I had no idea at the time. So he said, my brother in law happened to be this founder, you know, of KTEL and was looking for somebody like you and why don't you go meet with him? So that accountant, his name is Steven, opened one door for me. And then there's another wonderful guy. He's no longer with us, but his name is Larry.
[00:11:33] And Larry also put in a good word for me to be able to get that first opportunity. And then along the way, then along the way. You know, doing the grip ball product and, and being involved with that allowed me to then meet the guys from spin masters. So, you know, Anton, Ben, and Renan. have obviously been very, very important, you know opening doors for me being able to really blow up numerous brands using my talents and [00:12:00] direct to consumer marketing.
[00:12:01] And it really kind of cemented me in the toy industry as someone who was able to execute and, and, and market in a way that hadn't been done before. So I would say those kind of two, three things are critically important for my. You know ability to have, you know, kind of made it to where I am right now.
[00:12:20] Azhelle Wade: So we talked about the difference between an idea and an invention. I want to talk a little bit about
[00:12:26] Robert Yusim: that. Well, ideas are a dime a dozen. So There is very little value in an idea unless you do added value to turn it into, you know, a prototype, a patent, you know, a provisional patent application a video to support the, your proof of concept.
[00:12:45] So you, you know, an idea is one thing and, you know, but ideas have very little value because there's just so many of them that don't get executed. So it really comes down to the added value you as an inventor is willing to put in, and it doesn't have to cost a lot. You [00:13:00] can create a crude prototype that proves your concept, take a video of it on your phone to prove it, and that can be a starting point, you know, as a catalyst for, you know, the next steps.
[00:13:10] Azhelle Wade: Yeah, what value are you bringing to a company that would give them a reason to give you a percentage of anything?
[00:13:16] Robert Yusim: Yeah. And not only that, not only that, but in terms of the more value you add, the more, the better the deal you're gonna get when you do license it.
[00:13:26] Mm-Hmm. . So if you've put a lot of work in terms of prototyping and designing and conceptualizing what a finished product would be. Mm-Hmm. , it's gonna go a lot more than someone who has kind of like a crude prototype on a, on a, on a video. As a presentation, so the more you add, the more you're going to earn in royalties and potentially in advances and, you know, potentially in guarantees.
[00:13:51] When
[00:13:52] Azhelle Wade: you're looking to take on someone whose idea you're, you're willing to shop and license do you specifically look for [00:14:00] people that have a provisional patent or is that not? Always
[00:14:03] Robert Yusim: important. Listen, the more they have, the better. I have worked with many that don't have a provisional patent sometimes and an invention is not patentable.
[00:14:12] So, you know, then you're, you know, you're weighing the idea of should it be a first market opportunity or not. So, and I've worked on some of those. So I think they're all snowflakes. Every, every invention is a snowflake. They're all different. And it's just a matter of being able to look at the attributes of that particular, the uniqueness, what's the competition in the marketplace.
[00:14:32] Is there prior art that you'd be infringing upon? And then it's a matter of being able to determine based on so many different variables. Whether it's worthwhile to pursue.
[00:14:42] Azhelle Wade: So let's talk a little bit about inventions that are not patentable. What makes them licensable? Typically I tell my TCA students if there's a function or a mechanism, that's usually what you're going to be able to patent.
[00:14:54] And some non patentable ideas tend to be very branded, or they're games with mechanics [00:15:00] that you just can't patent. But I would love to hear from your opinion, Robert, like what Makes them licensable even when not patentable.
[00:15:07] Robert Yusim: So there might be like a patent that, you know, previously existed that may be expired, or maybe it's not infringing on a patent, but it's, but the features have been patented somewhere else in another way, shape, or form, but there may be something to a product that may have magical transformation, or it may have some magic that's never been exploited in the marketplace.
[00:15:28] I worked on a product that was an Israeli invention called a pop to play. And those are play structures that basically fold down and are able to, you know, go under a couch or behind a couch when they're not in use. And then when you're ready to use them, you pull them out and you pop them up and you got a slide or you got a kitchen center for the kids to play with in their living rooms.
[00:15:50] And it was ingenious because basically it gave people with smaller, you know, apartments or, or houses with limited space. You know, there's space back. They didn't have this big [00:16:00] plastic play structure in the middle of their living room. Mm-Hmm. . It wasn't patentable, but it had magic. So basically we were able to position it as a first to market opportunity and there, there, there were some elements that could be patentable and there were some consideration of that.
[00:16:15] Mm-Hmm. . But basically we were able to do the license deal without a patent in place.
[00:16:19] Azhelle Wade: Okay. This is a great example for people that you've worked with that want to license ideas, but as we were talking about your other client, you've also worked with, worked with entrepreneurs people who are selling their products either direct to consumers or to retailers.
[00:16:34] So. How have you worked with those people to help them bring their products to market once they have a prototype?
[00:16:41] Robert Yusim: Yeah, so I have decades of experience in consumer product marketing and you know over the many years Like I've met, you know, great manufacturers. I've met, you know, great You know other suppliers along the way other vendors that could help.
[00:16:56] So if there's a product Or, or, [00:17:00] or a small company that is just like very micro at the beginning stages and needs help, I'm really in a position to help them reduce their cost of goods. I'm in a position to help them optimize their Amazon and set up their Amazon in the best way possible. I'm able to actually architect all of their channels of distribution.
[00:17:20] I'm able to, you know, work on all the marketing elements to make sure that. Their product makes sense and it's well, you know, presented in the marketplace. I have access to influencers. I have access to direct to consumer marketing. I have access to the international marketplace.
[00:17:35] I met a company called Bit of Genius and they were at Astra and they had a product back then called Doodlematic.
[00:17:42] And you know, it was magical. I didn't know what I was looking at, but I knew it was magical. And they explained it to me and it was a, you know, video game maker and they had proven it out. They had done some maker fairs and they were just beginning their process. And you know, basically I said to him, I think that it could [00:18:00] be a digital strategy, but I think that you're also on the right track with your kit.
[00:18:04] But I didn't like the branding and I didn't really think that they were ready to attack the retail marketplace. And I suggested, you know, I might be able to help them. And we had some meetings, you know, after Astra and eventually I started giving them guidance and then I discovered like their cost of goods in China was like ridiculously high and we were able to reduce their cost of goods by 40 percent with my sources.
[00:18:27] And then you know, with the name Doodlematic, we discovered that there could be actually some infringement issues with that brand and really pushed the team. together for us to come up with a new name, which eventually became Pixicade, which I think is actually a great brand name. And then we were able to, you know, he had a really bad setup on Amazon and I was able to get him set up properly on Amazon and his year on your sales increased 1000%.
[00:18:52] So You know, based on all that, we were in a position, you know, he had the right cost of goods. He had the right marketing. [00:19:00] He had the right presentation on Amazon, and we did a direct to consumer campaign, and it was so successful. This little tiny company actually couldn't finance it on their own you know, and, and as you know, in the first year when a product is hot, there's a lot of.
[00:19:12] Attention to it. It's the best time to strike because if you miss that opportunity, it kind of dies on the vine. So the other element that I'm able to bring in is either strategic partnerships or investment. So I was able to find a strategic partner within literally 30 days that came in and did a In this case, it was a licensing deal for retail distribution in the United States.
[00:19:36] And it was a real catalyst to really kick the brand off and make sure that we were able to, you know, strike while the iron was hot.
[00:19:42] Azhelle Wade: Love that.
[00:19:43] Can you share your first big win when starting your company?
[00:19:46] Robert Yusim: Well, I mean, I, I think honestly it would have been the rocket fishing rod and moon sand when I worked back with spin those, you know, then after that we did something called the havoc heli helicopter and [00:20:00] I think they sold something like 11 million units of havoc heli, you know, back then.
[00:20:04] So like we were doing very, very large scale stuff. And then after working with spin, we worked together for five years and we built 80 campaigns in the U S Canada and UK. But after about five years, we very amicably went in different directions and I started working with some other companies. So there was a company called Katie interactive and they were partnered with Lee and fun, which is a very, very large Hong Kong based company, and they had a product called the Curio tablet.
[00:20:32] And, you know, basically I was able to put a campaign together for Curio and it was priced at, I think, at 149 for the original version. And then we did two subsequent versions and we did about 100 million on Curio tablets over that 18 month period.
[00:20:46] Azhelle Wade: What are you most proud of right
[00:20:48] Robert Yusim: now? I'm proud of my family and my kids.
[00:20:51] My daughter is actually expecting twins right now.
[00:20:53] I'm very proud of a lot of accomplishments. You know, I'm, I'm proud of the acknowledgement that I get in the toy industry. But I'm also [00:21:00] most proud of like the accomplishments of my kids. I, I'm very, very proud of them. They're each accomplished in their own unique way. One is a social worker, and she just got married earlier this year, and they just bought a house.
[00:21:11] My middle one is Lauren, and Lauren has actually joined me in many events in the toy industry. She actually was a An intern at Spinmaster two separate times, once in their marketing department and once in their legal department, cause now she's a lawyer and and she's expecting twins.
[00:21:28] So I'm very excited about that. And then my youngest Adam just graduated business school and he's planning on going to law school soon.
[00:21:35] Azhelle Wade: Fantastic. Well, in your business, what are you hoping to achieve one year from now?
[00:21:40] Robert Yusim: I have a number of new projects that I'm working on for 2024 and my goal for all of those is to be incredibly successful and set them all up for amazing success.
[00:21:50] And I'm working with some new innovations that I'm going to help launch and I'm working with a number of inventors right now to help place their inventions. And I'm working with some small micro companies to help [00:22:00] them, you know, guide them to become, you know, bigger companies.
[00:22:03] Azhelle Wade: And what is the best piece of advice you would have for someone starting their business right now?
[00:22:08] Robert Yusim: Wow. That's a great question. I mean, as a consumer product marketer, I would say, you know, make sure your product works, make sure that it's priced right from a cost of goods standpoint.
[00:22:20] Make sure that it all makes sense. Make sure you got the right brand name. Make sure that You're, you know, tying up all the loose ends and making sure you're not infringing on somebody else's, you know, IP. I think it's really a lot of the same things that we were talking about a little bit earlier in terms of making sure, you know, someone is positioned, you know, for amazing success.
[00:22:43] Azhelle Wade: Yes. And my last question, my favorite question for all of my guests, is what toy or game blew your mind as a kid?
[00:22:51] Robert Yusim: So, I grew up in a house that was like a multi level split level. So, from the top to the, to [00:23:00] the living room, there was another level down to the dining room, another one down to the kitchen, and then another level down to the basement and I bought Hot Wheels and I strung Hot Wheels tracks all the way from the top of the house to the bottom of the house.
[00:23:16] And we would have these amazing Hot Wheels races all the way from the top of the house down to the basement. That's very cool.
[00:23:23] Azhelle Wade: Yeah. Hot Wheels. Got it. Hot Wheels. And Robert, where can our guests reach out to you? If they're interested in working with you, where can they
[00:23:32] Robert Yusim: find you? So my website is productcouncil.
[00:23:36] com. So it's P R O D U C T C O U N S E L dot com. They can email me at R Y. Product council. com. And if they just Google me, I'm all over, you know, the internet. So they will be able to find me. They will be able to message me. I'm on LinkedIn. They can message me on LinkedIn as well. And I would love to hear from anyone who [00:24:00] feels that.
[00:24:00] I might be able to help them.
[00:24:02] Azhelle Wade: Yes. And if you happen to be driving while you're listening to this episode and you can't write it down, go to thetoycoachpodcast. com or just know that the link to connect with Rob will be in the show notes of this episode. So you can check the show notes as well. Thank you so much for joining us here today, Rob.
[00:24:18] It was great to chat with you. You were inspiring and I know that my listeners are going to reach out and look for your help.
[00:24:25] Robert Yusim: Oh, I'd love that. Thank you so much, Azhelle. Yeah. It was a pleasure.
[00:24:28] Azhelle Wade: Talk soon. Talk soon.
[00:24:30] Well, there you have it, Toy People, my interview with Rob Yousum. If you'd like to connect with Rob, head over to thetoycoach. com forward slash two zero five. Scroll down and look for those episode show notes so you can find all of the links that he had to share with us.
[00:24:45] Now, if you love this podcast and you haven't already left a review, what are you waiting for? Your reviews mean so much to me.
[00:24:52] I get a ding on my phone every time a new one comes in and it keeps me motivated to keep coming back week after week with [00:25:00] more Toyspirational episodes.
[00:25:01] As always, thank you so much for being with me here today. I know there are a ton of podcasts out there, so it truly means the world to me that you tune into this one. Until next week, I'll see you later, toy people. [00:26:00]
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